A few questions for Onenesss Pentecostal believers!

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A few years ago I was introduced to Onenesss Pentecostalism. As I began to discuss the deity of Christ with an expoused church member, I began to notice something unusual about their view concerning the nature of God. This prompted a few questions that I believe are valid and worthy of a response in order to determine if it falls within the “goalposts” of orthodox Christianity. 

  1. Is Jesus His own Father?
  2. If Jesus’ will and the Father’s will were identical, then why did Jesus express the desire to escape the cup but resigns Himself not to His own will, but the will of the Father? 
  3. Was Jesus praying to Himself in the Garden of Gethsemane?
  4. If Jesus was praying to the divine side of Himself, then isn’t He still praying to Himself?
  5. Why was Jesus not saying, “Not My will, but MY will be done?” if there is only one person and one will involved when He was praying in Luke 22:42 & Matt. 26:39.
  6. If he goes to hell, then faith in Christ isn’t sufficient to save him is it?
  7. Since the Bible teaches us that Jesus is in bodily form now (Col. 2:9), then how does the Oneness Pentecostal person maintain that God is in the form of the Holy Spirit?  Also, when Jesus returns, will He return in His body?  Will God’s form then revert to the form of the Son at a later date? 
  8. If God is only one person, why did Jesus say in John 14:23, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.”  If God is only one person, why does Jesus say, “we”?
  9. Oneness theology teaches that God was in the mode of the Father in the Old Testament.  God was seen in the OT (not as a vision or a dream or an angel in the following verses:  Exo. 6:2-3; Gen. 19:24; Num. 12:6-8).  But, Jesus said no one has seen the Father (John 6:46).  If they were seeing God Almighty (Exo. 6:2-3) but it wasn’t the Father, then who was it?

This is a cross section of questions that should provoke some thought and give cause to consult Scripture. We must always test all things and hold fast that which is good. 1Th 5:21 This is a command to you, me and Christians in all denominations, whether we think we’re right or not!

God bless!

Jim Richardson

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8 Responses

  1. Hi Jim,
    Thanks for visiting my site and leaving a comment.
    You got some very interesting writings here!
    I like your quote, “whether we think we’re right or not!” Love it~!

    Love,
    DulceDiana

  2. First off let me say hello and I am new here so I have not read all that you have written but “holkding fast to that which is good” that’s important enough to get me to visit here awhile and often.

    Second I am not a “oneness pentecostal” so my answers to your questions would reflect that.

    I find your questions interesting while I ponder them just wanted you to know a group I hang out with every Sunday…they call it Sunday School archaic maybe but we are really just believers gathering in search of the Truth…

    We have been looking at Genesis 1:26-37
    26: And God said, Let us make man in our own image,after our likeness: and let them have dominion……

    God said Us, our

    27: So God created man his image (the word own is in italics in the KJV I am using added for what the translators call clarity….) either way…in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.

    So when God spoke he was addressing someone in particular and equating them with himself inviting someone to take part in his creation of man.

    God speaks, the Word comes forth, and the Spirit is the Breath that carries the Word.
    Just like we speak…

    If man could get the thoughts of his minds subject to the word of God, breathed by His spirit would he too not walk in his body…in spirit and truth…

    1John 5:7 says it best….three are one…..three persons in one accord…

    May not be “theologically right” to some but this is where I am…

    1. Jesus is the Son of God, an obedient Son (that alone is foreign in this world) He existed with God and was in God as God’s Word…God spoke the Word and it was LIght on the First day…..some 4000 years later that same Light came in the flesh …Jesus called Him Father because he was born out of God…so Jesus was not his own Father..
    A virgin gave birth because she conceived the Word of God in abedience and submitted allowing her own nature to be overshadow by God’s will…

    Forgive me zeal has consumed me and I have written to long….until permission granted I will learn from your site in silence you have a “good word” here.

  3. All of your questions can be answered here:

    http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/pentecostal/One-Top.htm

    God bless..

    Steve Ares

  4. hi Jim

    Thanks for a great blog. These are amazing questions and ones which come out of much thought. and must be answered.

    I have had these same questions posted to me and if you care you may
    see my answers on the above link. Heres an incline.

    Is Jesus his own father? No! Isaiah calls him the ‘Everlasting Father'(Isaiah9:6), Is Isaiah a liar? No of course not.

    How can Jesus then be both Father and Son? the answer of course is through
    the incarnation. Hes the mighty God in the old testament and the God who
    became flesh in the new The father in the old the Son in the new.

    Why Jim any man who has children will tell you that they are both Father and Son yet one person.

    Immanuel God with us, So its clear and simple the Son didnt take on flesh the Mighty God did.

    lets exalt Jesus to his highest office, that of God.

    If hes not God then hes not Emmanuel and lastly If hes not God then when will God come Isaiah 35:4-6?

    Regards and God bless you

    Paul Thomas.

  5. 1. Did Jesus Christ have two fathers? The Father is the Father of the Son (I John 1:3), yet the child born of Mary was conceived by the Holy Ghost (Matthew 1:18, 20; Luke 1:35). Which one is the true father? Some trinitarians say that the Holy Ghost was merely the Father’s agent in conception – a process they compare to artificial insemination! [109]

    2. How many Spirits are there? God the Father is a Spirit (John 4:24), the Lord Jesus is a Spirit (II Corinthians 3:17), and the Holy Spirit is a Spirit by definition. Yet there is one Spirit (I Corinthians 12:13; Ephesians 4:4).

    3. If Father and Son are co-equal persons, why did Jesus pray to the Father? (Matthew 11:25). Can God pray to God?

    4. Similarly, how can the Son not know as much as the Father? (Matthew 24:36; Mark 13:32).

    5. Similarly, how can the Son not have any power except what the Father gives Him? (John 5:19, 30; 6:38).

    6. Similarly, what about other verses of Scripture indicating the inequality of the Son and the Father? (John 8:42; 14:28; I Corinthians 11:3).

    7. Did “God the Son” die? The Bible says the Son died (Romans 5:10). If so, can God die? Can part of God die?

    8. How can there be an eternal Son when the Bible speaks of the begotten Son, clearly indicating that the Son had a beginning? (John 3:16; Hebrews 1:5-6).

    9. If the Son is eternal and existed at creation, who was His mother at that time? We know the Son was made of a woman (Galatians 4:4).

    10. Did “God the Son” surrender His omnipresence while on earth? If so, how could he still be God?

    11. If the Son is eternal and immutable (unchangeable), how can the reign of the Son have an ending? (I Corinthians 15:24-28).

    12. If in answer to questions 3 through 11 we say only the human Son of God was limited in knowledge, was limited in power, and died, then how can we speak of “God the Son”? Are there two Sons?

    13. Whom do we worship and to whom do we pray? Jesus said to worship the Father (John 4:21-24), yet Stephen prayed to Jesus (Acts 7:59-60).

    14. Can there be more than three persons in the Godhead? Certainly the Old Testament does not teach three but emphasizes oneness. If the New Testament adds to the Old Testament message and teaches three persons, then what is to prevent subsequent revelations of additional persons? If we apply trinitarian logic to interpret some verses of Scripture, we could teach a fourth person (Isaiah 48:16; Colossians 1:3; 2:2; I Thessalonians 3:11; James 1:27). Likewise, we could interpret some verses of Scripture to mean six more persons (Revelation 3:1; 5:6).

    15. Are there three Spirits in a Christian’s heart? Father, Jesus, and the Spirit all dwell within a Christian (John 14:17, 23; Romans 8:9; Ephesians 3:14-17). Yet there is one Spirit (I Corinthians 12:13; Ephesians 4:4).

    16. There is only one throne in heaven (Revelation 4:2). Who sits upon it? We know Jesus does (Revelation 1:8,18, 4:8). Where do the Father and the Holy Spirit sit?

    17. If Jesus is on the throne, how can He sit on the right hand of God? (Mark 16:19). Does He sit or stand on the right hand of God? (Acts 7:55). Or is He in the Father’s bosom? (John 1:18).

    18. Is Jesus in the Godhead or is the Godhead in Jesus? Colossians 2:9 says the latter.

    19. Given Matthew 28:19, why did the apostles consistently baptize both Jews and Gentiles using the name of Jesus, even to the extent of rebaptism? (Acts 2:38; 8:16; 10:48; 19:5; 22:16; I Corinthians 1:13).

    20. Who raised Jesus from the dead? Did the Father (Ephesians 1:20), or Jesus (John 2:19-21), or the Spirit? (Romans 8:11).

    21. If Son and Holy Ghost are co-equal persons in the Godhead, why is blasphemy of the Holy Ghost unforgivable but blasphemy of the Son is not? (Luke 12:10).

    22. If the Holy Ghost is a co-equal member of the trinity, why does the Bible always speak of Him being sent from the Father or from Jesus? (John 14:26; 15:26).

    23. Does the Father know something that the Holy Spirit does not know? If so, how can they be co-equal? Only the Father knows the day and hour of the Second Coming of Christ (Mark 13:32).

    24. Did the trinity make the Old and New covenants? We know the LORD (Jehovah) did (Jeremiah 31:31-34; Hebrews 8:7-13). If Jehovah is a trinity then Father, Son, and Spirit all had to die to make the new covenant effective (Hebrews 9:16-17).

    25. If the Spirit proceeds from the Father, is the Spirit also a son of the Father? If not, why not?

    26. If the Spirit proceeds from the Son, is the Spirit the grandson of the Father? If not, why not?

  6. could please answer this Question?im a trinitarian i am confused when my my friend gave me this website…Richard
    1. Did Jesus Christ have two fathers? The Father is the Father of the Son (I John
    1:3), yet the child born of Mary was conceived by the Holy Ghost (Matthew 1:18, 20; Luke 1:35). Which one is the true father? Some trinitarians say that the Holy Ghost was merely the Father’s agent in conception – a process they compare to artificial insemination! [109]

    2. How many Spirits are there? God the Father is a Spirit (John 4:24), the Lord Jesus is a Spirit (II Corinthians 3:17), and the Holy Spirit is a Spirit by definition. Yet there is one Spirit (I Corinthians 12:13; Ephesians 4:4).

    3. If Father and Son are co-equal persons, why did Jesus pray to the Father? (Matthew 11:25). Can God pray to God?

    4. Similarly, how can the Son not know as much as the Father? (Matthew 24:36; Mark 13:32).

    5. Similarly, how can the Son not have any power except what the Father gives Him? (John 5:19, 30; 6:38).

    6. Similarly, what about other verses of Scripture indicating the inequality of the Son and the Father? (John 8:42; 14:28; I Corinthians 11:3).

    7. Did “God the Son” die? The Bible says the Son died (Romans 5:10). If so, can God die? Can part of God die?

    8. How can there be an eternal Son when the Bible speaks of the begotten Son, clearly indicating that the Son had a beginning? (John 3:16; Hebrews 1:5-6).

    9. If the Son is eternal and existed at creation, who was His mother at that time? We know the Son was made of a woman (Galatians 4:4).

    10. Did “God the Son” surrender His omnipresence while on earth? If so, how could he still be God?

    11. If the Son is eternal and immutable (unchangeable), how can the reign of the Son have an ending? (I Corinthians 15:24-28).

    12. If in answer to questions 3 through 11 we say only the human Son of God was limited in knowledge, was limited in power, and died, then how can we speak of “God the Son”? Are there two Sons?

    13. Whom do we worship and to whom do we pray? Jesus said to worship the Father (John 4:21-24), yet Stephen prayed to Jesus (Acts 7:59-60).

    14. Can there be more than three persons in the Godhead? Certainly the Old Testament does not teach three but emphasizes oneness. If the New Testament adds to the Old Testament message and teaches three persons, then what is to prevent subsequent revelations of additional persons? If we apply trinitarian logic to interpret some verses of Scripture, we could teach a fourth person (Isaiah 48:16; Colossians 1:3; 2:2; I Thessalonians 3:11; James 1:27). Likewise, we could interpret some verses of Scripture to mean six more persons (Revelation 3:1; 5:6).

    15. Are there three Spirits in a Christian’s heart? Father, Jesus, and the Spirit all dwell within a Christian (John 14:17, 23; Romans 8:9; Ephesians 3:14-17). Yet there is one Spirit (I Corinthians 12:13; Ephesians 4:4).

    16. There is only one throne in heaven (Revelation 4:2). Who sits upon it? We know Jesus does (Revelation 1:8,18, 4:8). Where do the Father and the Holy Spirit sit?

    17. If Jesus is on the throne, how can He sit on the right hand of God? (Mark 16:19). Does He sit or stand on the right hand of God? (Acts 7:55). Or is He in the Father’s bosom? (John 1:18).

    18. Is Jesus in the Godhead or is the Godhead in Jesus? Colossians 2:9 says the latter.

    19. Given Matthew 28:19, why did the apostles consistently baptize both Jews and Gentiles using the name of Jesus, even to the extent of rebaptism? (Acts 2:38; 8:16; 10:48; 19:5; 22:16; I Corinthians 1:13).

    20. Who raised Jesus from the dead? Did the Father (Ephesians 1:20), or Jesus (John 2:19-21), or the Spirit? (Romans 8:11).

    21. If Son and Holy Ghost are co-equal persons in the Godhead, why is blasphemy of the Holy Ghost unforgivable but blasphemy of the Son is not? (Luke 12:10).

    22. If the Holy Ghost is a co-equal member of the trinity, why does the Bible always speak of Him being sent from the Father or from Jesus? (John 14:26; 15:26).

    23. Does the Father know something that the Holy Spirit does not know? If so, how can they be co-equal? Only the Father knows the day and hour of the Second Coming of Christ (Mark 13:32).

    24. Did the trinity make the Old and New covenants? We know the LORD (Jehovah) did (Jeremiah 31:31-34; Hebrews 8:7-13). If Jehovah is a trinity then Father, Son, and Spirit all had to die to make the new covenant effective (Hebrews 9:16-17).

    25. If the Spirit proceeds from the Father, is the Spirit also a son of the Father? If not, why not?

    26. If the Spirit proceeds from the Son, is the Spirit the grandson of the Father? If not, why not?

  7. If you would allow me, I would like to take some time to shed some light in this subject. First, according to language, the us it is talking about in Genesis when God created man, is there due to the fact that when speaking of Dieties, you have to us a plural form of the word. Notice that the Bible clarifies who it was talking about in the next few verses, it says and God created man in His own image.

    The Jews believe in a monotheism aproach to God. They believed that because the God said in Isaiah 44:6- Thus saith the LORD the King of Israel, and his redeemer the LORD of hosts; I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is no God. This belief of Monotheism is also correct for us today. There is but one God (Mark 12:32).

    Now the next thing to understand is that this one God is a spirit. John 4:24- God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in Spirit and truth.

    Once we understand that their is one God, and this one God is a Spirit, we must understand who Jesus is.

    The mighty God was manifested in the flesh. God is manifested in Jesus. Remember, Isaiah 9:6 tells us- For unto us a child is born and unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counselor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.

    Jesus said in John 10:30- I and my father are one. The Jews had answered him in verses 31-33-
    Then the Jews took up stones again to stone him.
    Jesus answered them, Many good works have I shewed you from my Father; for which of those works do ye stone me?
    The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God.

    Now that we know Jesus is God, and that God is God. We run into a problem, there is but one God. So who really is God?

    Jesus said in Revelation 1:18- I am the Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty.

    God had said He was the first and the last in Isaiah 41:4, and 44:6.

    The problem is that people can’t understand how Jesus could be both Man and God. But He was.
    As a man, Jesus hungered, as God He feed five thousand people. As a man, Jesus experianced pain. As God he healed the sick and raised the dead.

    The scripture says in 1 Timothy 2:5- For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus. God in His experience as a man, bridged the gap between God and man, through the sacrifice on the cross.

    In the NIV edition of the Bible, Titus 2:13 moves the comma to read- the glorious appearing of our great God and Saviour, Jesus Christ. Showing us that their are not two different people in the God head, but only one Jesus Christ.

    Jesus told Phillip “He that seeth me hath seen the Father.”

    Jesus, the man prayed to the Spirit in Heaven. Not all of God went into Jesus, God was both in Jesus and in Heaven.

    Let me ask you something. Jesus was called the Son of David. Is he the literal son of David? He must be because people take literally the Son of God.

    Or could it be that Son of had a deeper meaning? Back then Son of meant in the flesh. Jesus was also God in the Flesh.

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